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<title><![CDATA[Indus Script May Reveal It's Secrets!!!]]></title>
<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html</link>
<description><![CDATA[<p>Indus Script is a writing system.. says recent paper...&nbsp;</p>
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<author><![CDATA[<script>
document.write("<a href=mailto:"); document.write("sujayrao2000"+"%40"); document.write("yahoo.com>Sujay Rao</a>");
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<a href="mailto:sujayrao2000 at yahoo dot com">Sujay Rao</a>
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<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment12</link>
<description><![CDATA[Few sensible scholars will be able to deny that the Indus script was a logo-syllabic script. Facts about the Dholavira signboard. However seals may have been non-linguistic.<br /><br />(a) It is one of the most famous of Harappan inscriptions.<br /><br />(b) It was very large in size.<br /><br />(c) It was located in Far from Mesopotamia Dholavira and in one of the furthest sites from Mesopotamia.<br /><br />(d) It hung over the citadel there.<br /><br />(e) It must have represented the name of the place and must have been closely tied to speech: note the sign repetition.<br /><br />(f) The sign which was used as a determinative was a very common Indus sign.<br /><br />(g) The sign used as a determinative appears to have been also similar to determinatives in other writing systems.<br /><br />(h) The Indus script was also related to Proto-Elamite which means it probably had a linguistic component.<br /><br />(i) The other signs with which the determinative was used were also common Indus signs.<br /><br />(j) Few sensible scholars will now dispute the fact that the Indus script was a logo-syllabic script on the basis of this evidence.<br /><br />(k) Few sensible scholars will deny the fact that speech encoding was one of the major functions of the Indus script and had this feature had reached a very precocious maturity.<br /><br />(l) This inscription was apparently more closely tied to speech than most proto-Elamite inscriptions.<br /><br />(m) Dholavira was not even the most important of sites.<br /><br />(n) The fact that it was hung over the citadel meant it was meant to be read by elites.<br /><br />(o) It was put to the most frivolous use.<br /><br />(p) Speech encoding would have been a prized possession: no one would have used it just for a decorative signboard at far-from-Mesopotamia Dholavira. Why would a man who had inscribed this, done so (a) if nobody else could read it (b) why would he have learnt to encode speech only to inscribe this signboard? This automatically implies the existence of longer texts. It also shows that the Indus elites used more complex forms of communication.<br /><br />(q) Even if we assume that speech-encoding was added in Mature Harappan 3B, this logic would still hold good.<br /><br />(r) This logic is already accepted by mainstream Indus archaeologists as a precursor to the existence of longer texts<br /><br /><br />please refer to the book by Jane Macintosh (Mcintosh 2008 p 374) &quot;The Harappans did not create monumental art or architecture on which such inscriptions may have been written. The nearest that the Harappans came to this is the Dholavira signboard which is quite possibly the tip of the iceberg of a now vanished public inscriptions.Farmers arguments fail to account convincingly for the structural regularities that analysis have revealed in the use of Harappan signs. These strongly seem to support the hypothesis that the Indus script represent a writing system&quot;<br /><br />This also proves that much longer texts existed]]></description>
<pubDate>Sat, 18 Jun 2011 09:00:15 +0530</pubDate>
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<author><![CDATA[leave it]]></author>
<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment11</link>
<description><![CDATA[<img style="border: 0px; vertical-align: middle;" alt="smile" src="http://dilipkumar.in/cms/data/emoticons/smile.gif" /><img style="border: 0px; vertical-align: middle;" alt="smile" src="http://dilipkumar.in/cms/data/emoticons/smile.gif" /><img style="border: 0px; vertical-align: middle;" alt="smile" src="http://dilipkumar.in/cms/data/emoticons/smile.gif" /><img style="border: 0px; vertical-align: middle;" alt="smile" src="http://dilipkumar.in/cms/data/emoticons/smile.gif" /><img style="border: 0px; vertical-align: middle;" alt="smile" src="http://dilipkumar.in/cms/data/emoticons/smile.gif" />:smil<br />e:<img style="border: 0px; vertical-align: middle;" alt="smile" src="http://dilipkumar.in/cms/data/emoticons/smile.gif" />thank u]]></description>
<pubDate>Thu, 19 May 2011 13:23:47 +0530</pubDate>
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<author><![CDATA[<script>
document.write("<a href=mailto:"); document.write("sujayrao2000"+"%40"); document.write("yahoo.com>Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>");
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<a href="mailto:sujayrao2000 at yahoo dot com">Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>
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<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment10</link>
<description><![CDATA[my published paper 'The reconfirmation and reinforcement of the Indus script thesis' . this was published in a scienfitic journal recently. <br />This shows why longer texts certainly existed in the Indus and why the Indus script was logo-syllabic. This is a complete refutation of Farmers thesis and refutes sproat's smoking gun completely. If Farmer disagrees, he has to reply to me point by point<br /><br />Sujay Rao Mandavilli<br /><br /><br />http://www.scribd.com/doc/46387240/Sujay-Indus-Script-Final-Version-Final-F<br />inal]]></description>
<pubDate>Fri, 18 Mar 2011 11:13:20 +0530</pubDate>
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<author><![CDATA[<script>
document.write("<a href=mailto:"); document.write("jeyakumar1962"+"%40"); document.write("gmail.com>jeyakumar ramasami</a>");
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<a href="mailto:jeyakumar1962 at gmail dot com">jeyakumar ramasami</a>
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<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment9</link>
<description><![CDATA[Dear Dilip,<br />Thanks for compliments. I have been following these issues for the past 25 years through books only . I have not done any research on these issues, it is only a different interpretations based on the already available materials. bye thank you --- rjk]]></description>
<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2011 15:13:12 +0530</pubDate>
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<author><![CDATA[<script>
document.write("<a href=mailto:"); document.write("knahmad52"+"%40"); document.write("gmail.com>khalid ahmad</a>");
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<noscript>
<a href="mailto:knahmad52 at gmail dot com">khalid ahmad</a>
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<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment8</link>
<description><![CDATA[okay, this angry cricket commentary is not good enough.The ball is in our court we have to intensify our efforts to enlighten the gora sahib of what mitti we are made of. Anybody who has little bit insight has to come forward and do his/her thing.Keep it up doordarshano!]]></description>
<pubDate>Sat, 20 Nov 2010 06:37:35 +0530</pubDate>
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<author><![CDATA[<script>
document.write("<a href=mailto:"); document.write("sujayrao2000"+"%40"); document.write("yahoo.com>Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>");
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<noscript>
<a href="mailto:sujayrao2000 at yahoo dot com">Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>
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<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment7</link>
<description><![CDATA[Witzel and racism at Harvard<br /><br />Please go through the Indo-Eurasian research list if you want to find out who is right and who is wrong. There is not a single post by Steve Famer which does not constitute India-bashing directly or indirectly. This is not called scholarship. This is called racism. And the racism in this case is indirectly abetted by Harvard. I don't know whether he comes to India only for our money. Someone must enlighten me. The so-called scholarly conference on Indology in November 2010 is a farce and has been hijacked by the Farmer-Witzel duo. Again, you don't have to beleive what I have to say blindly. Please use your judgmement. Do your own homework and then judge.]]></description>
<pubDate>Thu, 23 Sep 2010 10:08:40 +0530</pubDate>
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<author><![CDATA[<script>
document.write("<a href=mailto:"); document.write("abg.200"+"%40"); document.write("gmail.com>Abhijeet Ganguly</a>");
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<a href="mailto:abg dot 200 at gmail dot com">Abhijeet Ganguly</a>
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<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment6</link>
<description><![CDATA[The assertsion by Steve Farmer that the Indus script doesn;t encode a language and merely pictograms which could be either political or religous symbols doesn't hold water. According to him, the Indus people were functionally illiterate can't be true because it is a well established fact that the Indus people had trade links with the Mesopotamian civilisation.How can people carry out trade in far off places/ regions if you don't have a proper system of communication and recordings, measurements etc? How could the Indus people have communicated with the Mesopotamians without a proper language? Just signs are not enough to establish extensive trade links!<br />What Farmer said what completely off the track.]]></description>
<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jun 2010 15:29:57 +0530</pubDate>
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<author><![CDATA[<script>
document.write("<a href=mailto:"); document.write("sujayrao2000"+"%40"); document.write("yahoo.com>Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>");
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<noscript>
<a href="mailto:sujayrao2000 at yahoo dot com">Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>
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<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment5</link>
<description><![CDATA[Hi Dilip,<br /><br />You may read the latest book by Korvink<br /><br />The Indus script A positional-statistical approach]]></description>
<pubDate>Thu, 06 May 2010 15:53:15 +0530</pubDate>
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<author><![CDATA[<script>
document.write("<a href=mailto:"); document.write("sujayrao2000"+"%40"); document.write("yahoo.com>Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>");
</script>
<noscript>
<a href="mailto:sujayrao2000 at yahoo dot com">Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>
</noscript>]]></author>
<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment4</link>
<description><![CDATA[The Harappans had the oldest “signboard” in the world, apparently. They mass produced writing (or “writing”) . According to Parpola, 1/10th of<br />Mohendodaro (100 square metres) has yielded 2100 seals (with 9000 characters?). Or more than one character per person. I declare the Indus the most literate civilization on earth as every body could ‘read and write’ – Farmer.<br />This makes the debate so shallow it is nearly ridiculous. After all what then is the difference beteween the Indus and civilizations which did not yield any trace of writing? History is a subject after all and is taught everywhere in the world. Don’t mislead people deliberately and try to deceive them! We hate those who misrepresent history.<br />please find the article below. My comment is at the end. <br /><br />http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/war-of-words-in-the-cradle-of-south-asia<br />n-civilisation-1927005.html]]></description>
<pubDate>Thu, 06 May 2010 15:42:33 +0530</pubDate>
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<author><![CDATA[<script>
document.write("<a href=mailto:"); document.write("sujayrao2000"+"%40"); document.write("yahoo.com>Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>");
</script>
<noscript>
<a href="mailto:sujayrao2000 at yahoo dot com">Sujay Rao Mandavilli</a>
</noscript>]]></author>
<link>http://dilipkumar.in/articles/indus/indus-script-may-reveal-it-s-secrets.html#comment3</link>
<description><![CDATA[Even if a small linguistic component is added – rebus principle or punning (Witzel Kyoto, 2009 or Sproat in his presentations) or acriphony is added, it qualifies for full literacy. I assume some ’sound coding’ would have been useful to them atleast on some occasions.. the longest seal is 17 characters non-analomous and 26 characters analomous. I have never said that what Farmer is saying is necessarily fully wrong, but even Parpola has been reading them mostly as logograms with a linguistic component. So how much of what Farmer is saying is new apart from the fact that he popularized the idea? These men have been saying almost the same thing and fighting with each other?Till 2900 BC Egypt and Mesopotamia were considered proto-literate even if their texts are shorter(not non-literate!!!!)- even if there is small difference between the 2 maybe the Indus system was more expressive than Egyptian proto-literate- because conditional entropy, order of signs, combinations probably did play a major role in meaning in the Indus script (Korvink). ????Terminologies pertaining to literacy cannot be changed unless all scholars agree – and any demands to change terminology must be met with suspicion, naturally. Only a very small portion of the IVC has been excavated, you know, 5% maybe! Even Farmer agrees “Judging from modern examples and research in the linguistic history of South Asia, the Indus Valley was probably intensely multi linguistic throughout its history. This may have provided the Indus emblem system with an advantage over ordinary writing as a means of providing the civilization with social cohesion. The fact that the majority of inscriptions rely on a surprisingly small core of symbols suggests that the meaning of Indus signs could have potentially been known by almost or all (ALL!!) of the population, resulting in a pervasive quasiliteracy far beyond that achieved in Mesopotamia or Egypt.” No other civlization mass produced writing or (”writing”!!). Where else did they have public signboards then apart from the Indus?<br />I can instead cite Farmer and declare it the most literate civilization on erth. And he and I could be saying the same thing. I say such terms must be avoided. if they had learned how to use the rebus principle , they would have used it whenever the need arose. Seal writing is always short . Sproat's smoking gun cannot be used to test the stability or the complexity of the system. It has weaknesses. It cannot also be used to  prove that the Indus script didn't have a linguistic component.<br /><br />Making fun of ancient people is absolutely disgraceful.It is in poor taste~!!!!<br /><br />I hope more Indians take up research. people are taking us for a ride.<br /><br />Sujay Rao Mandavilli]]></description>
<pubDate>Fri, 30 Apr 2010 19:12:50 +0530</pubDate>
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